Identification help

[Fej]

Back in 2007 I walked past this bike almost daily going to class at SJSU. At the time I knew very little about bikes, and never did more than take this picture and do a few walk-arounds. I immediately fell in love with the frame and have been trying to figure out what it was ever since.

Found this picture on here earlier this year. Of course I don't remember what thread I found it in or who posted it. :roll:

I hate to have my first post(assuming the power stays on long enough) be a new thread asking a stupid question. But I've spent a few months trying to find more pictures on the forums with no luck.

I'd appreciate any help I can get in figuring out what the heck this bike is. Thanks in advance.

 

[B607]

Don't feel bad trying to identify a prewar frame, they can be tough. It will take our resident frame expert Phil to give you a 100% positive ID. Maybe he will show up here. In the mean time, here is a pic of a Schwinn 1939 "DX". Note that the 2 top bars are both curved. The front down tube is straight. You can see the chain adjustors on the rear dropouts and the ears built onto the frame for a dropstand.
Your first pic looks like a '39 Schwinn except for the extra material where the lower top tube meets the down tube. Someone may have added some Bondo when they repainted it...or maybe it's not a Schwinn at all. I don't know. Gary

 

[user 135]

The second pic is RatRod's Moto ELGIN.
viewtopic.php?p=111803#p111803

 

[Fej]

Thanks! Stoked to finally have a good idea of what it is. Been bugging the heck out of me for three years.

I remember thinking that it looked like filler was used to make the "fillet" between the top & bottom tubes. Are you sure thats a Schwinn in the picture? Cause the frame looks identical to the Elgin to me.

Now I just have to get my hands one. Should be easy, right? :?

 

[rms37]

The blue frame in the first picture and the black and white frame were both made by Murray-Ohio. The company had been involved in metal forming and pressing for years (they were well known for their line of pedal cars) before introducing their first line of bicycles in late 1936. These two frames could date from about that time to as late as perhaps 1940 but are probably from 1938 or 39.

Murray used a stamped and formed head tube that was butt welded to plain end tubes about an inch and a half behind the head tube. This is what looks like giant fillet welds on casual observation. The same process was used to form the wishbone rear stays.

Your are correct in your assumption that the fillet between the lower tank tube and the down tube is a non standard addition to the frame, probably made by the owner with bondo to capture the look of the other joints.

Those features separate the bike from the pictured Schwinn (which is a Schwinn) that uses more conventional construction in those areas.

If you are looking for one of these frames you are in luck because they are relatively plentiful, Murray produced probably well over 100,000 similar frames. Some were badged in-house as Mercury but they are most numerous badged for Sears as Elgins. Variations exist with and without wishbone seat stays and chain stays and later version have curved seat and down tubes

 

[Fej]

The blue frame in the first picture and the black and white frame were both made by Murray-Ohio. The company had been involved in metal forming and pressing for years (they were well known for their line of pedal cars) before introducing their first line of bicycles in late 1936. These two frames could date from about that time to as late as perhaps 1940 but are probably from 1938 or 39.

Murray used a stamped and formed head tube that was butt welded to plain end tubes about an inch and a half behind the head tube. This is what looks like giant fillet welds on casual observation. The same process was used to form the wishbone rear stays.

Your are correct in your assumption that the fillet between the lower tank tube and the down tube is a non standard addition to the frame, probably made by the owner with bondo to capture the look of the other joints.

Those features separate the bike from the pictured Schwinn (which is a Schwinn) that uses more conventional construction in those areas.

If you are looking for one of these frames you are in luck because they are relatively plentiful, Murray produced probably well over 100,000 similar frames. Some were badged in-house as Mercury but they are most numerous badged for Sears as Elgins. Variations exist with and without wishbone seat stays and chain stays and later version have curved seat and down tubes

I bow down to your superior knowledge. Now that you've pointed it out I can see subtle differences between the Elgin and Schwinn.

Looks like there's hope after all. Guess I'll put a wanted ad up. Thanks for the info.