Trying to Find my Grandfather's Bike

[Justin Hagan]

Hey guys,
I hoping to track down my Grandfather's bike in this picture (the one on the right) to restore it. Unfortunately, I'm no expert in vintage bikes and am not sure what model it is or who made it. Here's what I do know. The picture was taken in 1945, he bought it in Illinois, and it was Dark Blue and white. Any help identifying it would be great. And once I do know what it is, if you guys have any suggestions on where I could find one, I'd really appreciate that too. Thanks!

 

[Justin Hagan]

 

[heartlandcruisers]

i could be wrong but i believe those were called whizzer motorbikes built by Schwinn i believe.
i think there was also one called a motobike.
i would go with those 2
sean

 

[Justin Hagan]

i could be wrong but i believe those were called whizzer motorbikes built by Schwinn i believe.
i think there was also one called a motobike.
i would go with those 2
sean

Thanks Sean! He had mentioned that it wasn't always that way. Whatever bike he had he took to a place where they added it on. Im hoping to find whatever bike it is that he had modified with the Whizzer

 

[ifitsfreeitsforme]

awesome picture.

 

[Crassly]

The one on the left looks like a Shelby with the hidden springer. One on the right looks like it might be an Elgin. The Whizzer motors were sold as kits and could be attached to most any bike. Schwinn did make special frame to be used with the motors. Whizzer also had their own frames and sold complete motorbikes.

 

[heartlandcruisers]

The one on the left looks like a Shelby with the hidden springer. One on the right looks like it might be an Elgin. The Whizzer motors were sold as kits and could be attached to most any bike. Schwinn did make special frame to be used with the motors. Whizzer also had their own frames and sold complete motorbikes.

good call i never realized it but yeah the one on left does look like a Shelby.
i should a caught that since Shelby are my fav bikes lol
Sean

 

[Jpromo]

It's looking like your grandfather got the bike used and then bought a new Whizzer kit to put on the bike. These motors existed before the war, but very few were sold. They really flourished 1945 and later. The bike in question does indeed appear to be a Westfield built Elgin bike (versus Murray built). Due to the dramatic curve of the downtube, I'd say it was an Elgin Oriole circa 1936-38. The geometry in the photo is hard to pick up but that's the only prewar frame with a middle bar and that exact downtube curve.

Unfortunately, due to the dramatic lines of these frames, the structural integrity was lost a bit and they're known for cracking welds. I'd be a little leery of putting a motor on one especially now that they're 75 years old. Great riders for bicycle cruising speed though! And I'll be darned if they aren't one of the best looking non-tank classic bicycles.

 

[heartlandcruisers]

It's looking like your grandfather got the bike used and then bought a new Whizzer kit to put on the bike. These motors existed before the war, but very few were sold. They really flourished 1945 and later. The bike in question does indeed appear to be a Westfield built Elgin bike (versus Murray built). Due to the dramatic curve of the downtube, I'd say it was an Elgin Oriole circa 1936-38. The geometry in the photo is hard to pick up but that's the only prewar frame with a middle bar and that exact downtube curve.

Unfortunately, due to the dramatic lines of these frames, the structural integrity was lost a bit and they're known for cracking welds. I'd be a little leery of putting a motor on one especially now that they're 75 years old. Great riders for bicycle cruising speed though! And I'll be darned if they aren't one of the best looking non-tank classic bicycles.

+1 on looking sweet i like this frame design

 

[Justin Hagan]

Guys thanks so much for all the help, I really appreciate it! I was hoping that I could put a Whizzer on it so thanks for the heads up. I found this pair of Western Fliers. Would they be an appropriate (and more durable) substitute?

 

[kingfish254]

I zoomed in and cropped your granddad's bike. This might help.

 

[Jpromo]

Guys thanks so much for all the help, I really appreciate it! I was hoping that I could put a Whizzer on it so thanks for the heads up. I found this pair of Western Fliers. Would they be an appropriate (and more durable) substitute?

Personally, if you're going to buy a real deal vintage whizzer kit, I would pick up a bike from the period. Most prewar or early postwar bikes will be very solid with no concerns. They'd be more structurally suited than those late 60s Western Flyers which are middleweight bikes anyway. I made a klunker out of a 60s WF and it definitely does not take the abuse well. You can get a low-equipped or repainted 30s-50s ballooner at a pretty fair price--especially considering you would not want it to be a tank bike.

I'd look for a 40s Schwinn B6 (which was the frame that Schwinn offered the whizzer on) or a CWC Roadmaster which was also offered by Cleveland Welding co with a Whizzer kit. Most period bike frames would be equally suitable but those bikes will be a sure fit with no modifications (except for a dimple on the seat stay). The Roadmaster would be my #1 pick since they'll be much cheaper than Schwinns and they really are some of the best constructed bikes in my opinion. Every one I've had just feels solid as a rock. Here's a 1945 I had to give you an idea of what they look like from the period:

Your best bet may be to just buy a complete or nearly complete bike with the kit already. There was just one on one of the bike forums for a very fair price.. cheaper than you could piece one together.

 

[Jpromo]

I zoomed in and cropped your granddad's bike. This might help.
View attachment 3447

That helps. I'm still leaning on an Oriole; everything screams it except the orientation of the middle bar--it's riding up. I'm thinking it got moved to accommodate the motor, because the shape of the present middle bar looks right. Looking at the stock frame, you can tell it definitely wouldn't fit a motor as-is.

One of the coolest family bike photos I've seen too!

 

[Justin Hagan]

Personally, if you're going to buy a real deal vintage whizzer kit, I would pick up a bike from the period. Most prewar or early postwar bikes will be very solid with no concerns. They'd be more structurally suited than those late 60s Western Flyers which are middleweight bikes anyway. I made a klunker out of a 60s WF and it definitely does not take the abuse well. You can get a low-equipped or repainted 30s-50s ballooner at a pretty fair price--especially considering you would not want it to be a tank bike.

I'd look for a 40s Schwinn B6 (which was the frame that Schwinn offered the whizzer on) or a CWC Roadmaster which was also offered by Cleveland Welding co with a Whizzer kit. Most period bike frames would be equally suitable but those bikes will be a sure fit with no modifications (except for a dimple on the seat stay). The Roadmaster would be my #1 pick since they'll be much cheaper than Schwinns and they really are some of the best constructed bikes in my opinion. Every one I've had just feels solid as a rock. Here's a 1945 I had to give you an idea of what they look like from the period:

Your best bet may be to just buy a complete or nearly complete bike with the kit already. There was just one on one of the bike forums for a very fair price.. cheaper than you could piece one together.

Jpromo, thanks so much. You've been beyond helpful. Do you happen to remember what forum the bike you mentioned was listed on

 

[deven_science]

With that zoom in that Kingfish did, I don't think it's an Oriole. Midtube doesn't look right.

 

[Jpromo]

With that zoom in that Kingfish did, I don't think it's an Oriole. Midtube doesn't look right.

That was my only reservation on the ID. But I think it can be explained because an Oriole would not have enough space for an engine. The curvature of the bar is correct, it's just riding up towards the back. I'm thinking it got moved up in back.

The chainring, frame joints, and fork all suggest Westfield construction. Fenders are universal replacements. Then, the only bikes to have that radical downtube curve were Elgin Orioles, Blackhawks, Robins and Bluebirds. Blackhawks were completely different all around and it's not that. Bluebirds all have integrated tank except for 1938 which was the same as a Robin frame, but those did not have a middle bar at all. Judging by his seated position, it's definitely likely that it has the curved seat post too. It's a tough one and I generally try to avoid the modified argument, but there's nothing else that would be a match for everything else the bike is telling us.