Reattaching Front Fender

[Flying Zombie]

So heres another post with probably too much said for how little the situation is.

I removed the front fender off my Columbia Westfield the second day I got it, for straightening.
The Long bolt holding it in, from within the fender I had to unscrew fell into the neck..
I let it go for a couple of days..
Feeling It would work its way out. Sure didn't.

So last night I took the handlebars off, to remove the bolt.
Of which I did with great success, so far as to also straighten the bars from the slight crook they had.
I hear a lot of bikes from this era that haven't been maintained in a while are really
locked up around the bars, so I'm grateful for that.
Problem is, I dont know how to use it to re-secure the front fender. When I slip it into the fender hole,
and into the Headtube.. theres nothing there for it to thread into... it just keeps going...
Finally, the Question:

Do I need to disassemble the front fork to reattach the Fender?! [If so, is it done by removing the handlebars..truss rod fitting..etc..etc..?]

FZ

 

[clamdigger]

I am trying to understand this. Usually the screw goes up trough the front fender hole and screws into an insert in the center of the fork steer tube. Now the screw just goes into air. So look and see if the insert has moved up higher in the fork steer tube.If it is missing it could have rolled down inside the frame to the pedal area. Shake, Rattle, and Roll !

 

[Wildcat]

I agree there should be something there for it to screw into. If it broke loose it's still there somewhere, (it may be lodged in the fork still, or as Clamdigger said, gone down into the frame) To bolt your fender back on then becomes the challenge. If you find the thing, Hold it in place while you put the fender on. How? By leaving the handlebar and stem off and using a rod of some kind in the fork tube to hold the bracket or nut in place while the screw starts to thread. Or easier than that, I have done some without the fork screw because the 2 braces on the fender, connected to the axle, held it tight enough.

 

[RustySprockets]

Depending on how original you want to be, there's always the option of using a "nutsert" to replace the broken or missing hardware.

 

[metalchewy]

Depending on how original you want to be, there's always the option of using a "nutsert" to replace the broken or missing hardware.

Agree, it sounds like your threads and rusted away and sound like you will need to either tap in larger threads or, drill a size up and insert a helicopter or thread insert.

I've welded these in and drilled and retapped them before, but without proper annealing they can crack

 

[Flying Zombie]

I am trying to understand this. Usually the screw goes up trough the front fender hole and screws into an insert in the center of the fork steer tube. Now the screw just goes into air. So look and see if the insert has moved up higher in the fork steer tube.If it is missing it could have rolled down inside the frame to the pedal area. Shake, Rattle, and Roll !

Thats not good, and mildly disconcerting.
Im glad you know what it attaches to, do you happen to have a photo in the event something odd falls out?

FZ

 

[Flying Zombie]

I agree there should be something there for it to screw into. If it broke loose it's still there somewhere, (it may be lodged in the fork still, or as Clamdigger said, gone down into the frame) To bolt your fender back on then becomes the challenge. If you find the thing, Hold it in place while you put the fender on. How? By leaving the handlebar and stem off and using a rod of some kind in the fork tube to hold the bracket or nut in place while the screw starts to thread. Or easier than that, I have done some without the fork screw because the 2 braces on the fender, connected to the axle, held it tight enough.

It gave a good chunk of resistance, coming out. Id be willing to bet its intact and whole.. whatever and wherever it is in the frame. Its threads worked to the last turn, and I dont recall If I heard a CLANK when it came loose, but that bolt wasnt having it right away.

I had a feeling I was gonna have to maneuver a nut or piece in place while I bolted the frame up, Im thinking I can do it with the bike laying on its side.
Mine is held on BY the braces, much like your shortcut, but if you look at my Recent ride picks.. In fact.. here..
Notice how far the fender is from the meeting point?

I've considered removing and reshaping the front fender to meet it closer, but I wasn't expecting this to be long term.
I have a feeling I'm gonna need a hand with this one..

FZ

 

[Flying Zombie]

Depending on how original you want to be, there's always the option of using a "nutsert" to replace the broken or missing hardware.

I had this image in my head of an anchor attached to elastic.
A little bar, like a beret clip.. attached with an elastic in its center, to hoist it close to what the pin is slid in to [in this case, the fork to the fender]..see what Im saying? Is your idea on these lines or.. Describe it~

FZ

 

[Flying Zombie]

Agree, it sounds like your threads and rusted away and sound like you will need to either tap in larger threads or, drill a size up and insert a helicopter or thread insert.

I've welded these in and drilled and retapped them before, but without proper annealing they can crack

Im feelin it might be a piece that just ended up rocking around a different area inside the frame. a few pokes and some light should shine onto the next possible answer, with any luck.
Worst case, I get a hold of Brian.. [If I can].. and ask for a little time to clash.

 

[RustySprockets]

A nutsert is just a fancy type of pop-rivet that can be installed from one side of a work surface. I believe it is the very same thing that is used to add threaded mounting holes for bottle cages. frame pumps, etc. It usually requires a special tool to set them in place, but I think one could achieve the same action by simply tightening the bolt, causing the body of the insert to expand.

I guess the reason for the tool is to prevent the nutsert from spinning in the hole while it's being installed. That would be frustrating.

 

[Flying Zombie]

A nutsert is just a fancy type of pop-rivet that can be installed from one side of a work surface. I believe it is the very same thing that is used to add threaded mounting holes for bottle cages. frame pumps, etc. It usually requires a special tool to set them in place, but I think one could achieve the same action by simply tightening the bolt, causing the body of the insert to expand.

I guess the reason for the tool is to prevent the nutsert from spinning in the hole while it's being installed. That would be frustrating.

Sure would, like the handlebars smacking you in the back of the head while you're working on the seat.
Thanks again for the advice, I'll look into this method option.

FZ

 

[horsefarmer]

At least 1 of my bikes has a metal cap on the bottom of the steer tube and it is threaded for the screw that holds the fender - maybe if the threads are bad but that plate is there you can find a self tapping screw and let it cut new threads...

 

[Flying Zombie]

At least 1 of my bikes has a metal cap on the bottom of the steer tube and it is threaded for the screw that holds the fender - maybe if the threads are bad but that plate is there you can find a self tapping screw and let it cut new threads...

so If I got a self tapping screw,as apposed to using the original bolt, it would get cut right into the metal holed disc at the bottom of the steer tube?

FZ

 

[horsefarmer]

http://www.homedepot.com/b/Tools-Hardware-Hardware-Fasteners-Screws-Sheet-Metal-Screws/N-5yc1vZc2bw

Description:
These sheet metal screws, or tapping screws, are highly versatile and are used to attach metal, wood, fiberglass, and plastic. The sharp threads draw material together and ensure a secure hold. Made from hardened steel, the threads create their own mating thread in pre-drilled holes. Sheet metal screws are fully threaded with a sharp point.

Yes, they should work, Only time I have trouble is if the sheet metal you are "threading" is really thin or rotten (threads strip out) or if the material is really hard (threads on screw strip out) The kind pictured have a tiny drill bit built into the end usually work well.
Of course you will have to pick the size screw, screw head, ect you need.

 

[Flying Zombie]

http://www.homedepot.com/b/Tools-Hardware-Hardware-Fasteners-Screws-Sheet-Metal-Screws/N-5yc1vZc2bw

Description:
These sheet metal screws, or tapping screws, are highly versatile and are used to attach metal, wood, fiberglass, and plastic. The sharp threads draw material together and ensure a secure hold. Made from hardened steel, the threads create their own mating thread in pre-drilled holes. Sheet metal screws are fully threaded with a sharp point.

Yes, they should work, Only time I have trouble is if the sheet metal you are "threading" is really thin or rotten (threads strip out) or if the material is really hard (threads on screw strip out) The kind pictured have a tiny drill bit built into the end usually work well.
Of course you will have to pick the size screw, screw head, ect you need.

Those look proper Durable. I really appreciate the information. Im in reach of a home depot at that. These seem to be the option then!

Thanks a lot!

FZ

 

[horsefarmer]

No problem. You might want to put a drop of oil on the thread end of the screw and go slow, even stop part way down (especially if the screw starts to bind) back it up a turn to clear metal shavings out of the way, and tighten.

 

[Flying Zombie]

No problem. You might want to put a drop of oil on the thread end of the screw and go slow, even stop part way down (especially if the screw starts to bind) back it up a turn to clear metal shavings out of the way, and tighten.

Oil, and collected shaving removal from threads. Alright, Noted.
thanks again
FZ